Jyllian Kemsley · Storify

Glove bag, gas manifold, or glove box

Jyllian Kemsley — Fri, 21 Dec 2012 23:14:31 GMT

Where would you handle a pyrophoric chemical?

Storified by Jyllian Kemsley · Fri, Dec 21 2012 15:14:31

One of the things that's come up in the court hearing on the #SheriSangji case is whether an experiment that involved handling an air-sensitive (but not pyrophoric) reagent in a glove bag counts as sufficient practice for handling tert-butyllithium at a gas manifold. I was curious whether chemists would actually handle tert-butyllithium in a glove bag, as opposed to a gas manifold or glove box.

Query for tert-butyllithium users: Is a glove bag inert enough environment for handling, or do you prefer gas manifold or glove box?
— Jyllian Kemsley · Wed, Dec 19 2012 07:03:38

Gas manifolds/Schlenk lines/vacuum lines and glove boxes win, hands down:

@jkemsley Never used a glove bag, so I don't know. Seems to me people don't love them, but that's a guess.
— Chemjobber · Wed, Dec 19 2012 07:04:26

@jkemsley @Chemjobber if you are skilled enough you can do it in a glove,but I would rather go for a glovebox
— Vittorio Saggiomo · Wed, Dec 19 2012 07:10:01

@V_Saggiomo @jkemsley @Chemjobber - Personally, I'd NEVER place a liquid pyrophoric in a glove bag. Schlenk line or glovebox for me, thanks.
— See Arr Oh · Wed, Dec 19 2012 07:46:35

@jkemsley Performing the experiment in hypoxic glove box would be safest. http://www.hypoxygen.us/
— BioRAFT · Wed, Dec 19 2012 07:47:30

@cenmag @jkemsley Glovebox or gas manifold is definitely safer! Not sure about the glovebag.
— Steve · Wed, Dec 19 2012 08:37:51

@jkemsley: Vacuum line hands down. We even transfer our lithiating reagents into bombs to avoid the awkward bottle situations.
— pHayesGroup · Thu, Dec 20 2012 07:49:47

#Chemsafety at #ACSPhilly, Tuesday edition

Jyllian Kemsley — Wed, 22 Aug 2012 19:12:16 GMT

Tweets on chemical health and safety from the ACS National Meeting in Philadelphia

Storified by Jyllian Kemsley · Wed, Aug 22 2012 12:12:16

Today's Division of Chemical Health & Safety programming included parts two and three of the symposium on "Creating a Safety Culture in Academic Institutions." Some people argue that all institutions already have a safety culture, the question is whether it's a good or positive one, so let's assume that the goal of the symposium was to focus on building a positive safety culture. Here's the storify from Sunday and Monday of the meeting:

#Chemsafety at #ACSPhilly, Sunday and Monday edition | The Safety Zone

August 20th, 2012 * 07:08 By Jyllian Kemsley * Posted in ACS National Meeting * No Comments

Now, onto Tuesday and creating good safety cultures. Like yesterday, Harry Elston of @MidwestChemSafe live-tweeted the sessions.Morning, talk 1: Steps to creating a safety culture in undergraduate chemistry laboratories, David Katz, chemistry professor, Pima Community College, in Arizona

Katz(PimaCC): Safety and Environmental topics covered in each lab session
— H.J.Elston · Tue, Aug 21 2012 06:11:53

Katz(Pima CC): Adjunct instructors can pose a challenge to information consistency between lab sections
— H.J.Elston · Tue, Aug 21 2012 06:16:07

Talk 2: Developing a safety culture from the bottom up, Sheila Kennedy, safety coordinator for undergraduate chemistry and biochemistry teaching labs, University of California, San Diego

Kennedy(UCSD)- Three papers from UCSD to dovetail together. This focuses on UG laboratories.
— H.J.Elston · Tue, Aug 21 2012 06:29:00

Kennedy(UCSD): UG students requested training! (Saw the TAs getting training and they wanted it).
— H.J.Elston · Tue, Aug 21 2012 06:30:17

Kennedy(UCSD): TA training shifts focus from "student" to laboratory supervision/management
— H.J.Elston · Tue, Aug 21 2012 06:32:21

Kennedy(UCSD): Level (and topics) for student training varies with the course. Basics covered in each but include topics for analchem, etc
— H.J.Elston · Tue, Aug 21 2012 06:34:49

Kennedy(UCSD) UCSD recognizes these students will be next gen. of professionals in all areas
— H.J.Elston · Tue, Aug 21 2012 06:37:03

Kennedy(UCSD): Labs foster expectations in the lab - "Tools beyond rules."
— H.J.Elston · Tue, Aug 21 2012 06:44:31

Talk 3: Generating a safety culture through the lab curriculum, David Finster, chemistry professor, Wittenberg University, in Ohio, and author of Laboratory Safety for Chemistry Students with Robert Hill

Finster(WU): 2008 CPT Guidelines "...promote a safety-conscious culture..."
— H.J.Elston · Tue, Aug 21 2012 06:49:48

Finster(WU): Safety topics and training should be tailored to course level and information presented in lab.
— H.J.Elston · Tue, Aug 21 2012 06:53:59

Finster(WU): Example - introduce nitric acid safety the first time student works with it. Save the LN2 topic until PChem when using it
— H.J.Elston · Tue, Aug 21 2012 06:55:25

Finster(WU): Topics are introduced to student first describing an incident involving the topic - gets the student's attention.
— H.J.Elston · Tue, Aug 21 2012 06:57:06

Finster(WU) Sometimes the students not always see the importance of safety...
— H.J.Elston · Tue, Aug 21 2012 07:02:29

Finster(WU): Fire service mantra "Everyone Goes Home" should be the same mantra in chemistry laboratory education
— H.J.Elston · Tue, Aug 21 2012 07:04:55

Talk 4: Making the connection between green chemistry and safety at the undergraduate level, Robert Hanson, chemistry professor, St. Olaf College, in Minnesota

#Chemsafety at #ACSPhilly, Sunday and Monday edition

Jyllian Kemsley — Wed, 22 Aug 2012 19:09:03 GMT

Tweets on chemical health and safety from the ACS National Meeting in Philadelphia

Storified by Jyllian Kemsley · Wed, Aug 22 2012 12:09:03

C&EN's @carmendrahl happened upon a safety debate in an organic chemistry division session fist thing on Sunday:

Should you use an azide when working with undergrads? Bit of a debate in ORGN talk by PI at prim.undergrad institution #chemsafety
— Carmen Drahl · Sun, Aug 19 2012 08:44:53

@carmendrahl depends on the azide. Training is required.
— Lewis Lab · Sun, Aug 19 2012 09:04:59

@carmendrahl Worth noting that NaN3 already used in undergrad bio courses for metabolic poison (natch.)
— Chemjobber · Sun, Aug 19 2012 21:08:50

@Chemjobber @carmendrahl I've used it as a preservative while working on my thesis. Also, takes a fair bit to kill someone.
— Canageek · Sun, Aug 19 2012 21:10:22

(I'll add in a tweet from down below--he wasn't responding to Carmen, but it's relevant)

Fivizzani: Chemists must be educated to work with hazardous materials. Leave hazardous materials in coursework!
— H.J.Elston · Mon, Aug 20 2012 11:53:33

Then:

#ACSPhilly convo goes to undergrad working hours. "if I push them and say you need to be in the lab more they quit"
— Carmen Drahl · Sun, Aug 19 2012 08:46:19

On Monday, Harry Elston of @MidwestChemSafe live-tweeted the Division of Chemical Health & Safety afternoon session on creating a (good) safety culture in academic institutions.

Introductory remarks by Larry Doemeny and Bob Hill. Problem recognized by CSB before incidents at UCLA and Texas Tech. #ACSPhilly
— H.J.Elston · Mon, Aug 20 2012 10:39:58

California Deal Tightens Lab Safety | August 13, 2012 Issue - Vol. 90 Issue 33 | Chemical & Engineering News

In an agreement aimed at improving laboratory safety across the nation's largest public university system, the Los Angeles County Distric...

Investigations Detail | U.S. Chemical Safety and Hazard Investigation Board

To find the root cause of an accident, CSB investigators conduct detailed interviews of witnesses, chemical samples and equipment from si...

Talk 1: Creating safety cultures in academic institutions: A report of the Safety Culture Task Force of the ACS Committee on Chemical Safety, Robert Hill, chair of the ACS Committee on Chemical Safety and a program manager for Battelle's Atlanta Analytical Services (report pdf)

Goal of project: Academic research can work safely
— H.J.Elston · Mon, Aug 20 2012 10:40:39

Hill (CCS): Report's purpose is to address safety concern in academic research. Expects consequences of UCLA to have ripple thru country
— H.J.Elston · Mon, Aug 20 2012 10:47:35

Hill(CCS): Elements of a strong safety culture: Mgmt, education, attitude, lessons learned, interaction, communication, mgmt support
— H.J.Elston · Mon, Aug 20 2012 10:50:25

Hill(CCS): leaders determine direction of program (Provost, Dept Chair, PIs). 17 recommendations in Report
— H.J.Elston · Mon, Aug 20 2012 10:53:55

Hill(CCS): Learning from incidents key to safety eduction. (Problem is getting incidents reported -HJE) #ACSPhilly
— H.J.Elston · Mon, Aug 20 2012 11:00:16

Talk 2: Here, there, and everywhere: How one campus successfully pays attention to undergraduate laboratory safety, Barbara Sawrey, associate vice chancellor for undergraduate education, University of California, San Diego

Chemophobia by a grant reviewer?

Jyllian Kemsley — Mon, 09 Apr 2012 22:46:27 GMT

It's the Rheo Thing posted what seemed like a chemophobic comment by a grant application reviewer. I included the link in the Safety Zone's weekly round-up of chemical health and safety news. Some discussion followed on Twitter.

Storified by Jyllian Kemsley · Mon, Apr 09 2012 15:46:27

John's post and his own tweet:

It's the Rheo Thing: Chemophobia - from a grant reviewer?

My latest SBIR grant got shot down. Fine, it happens, there will be more opportunities in the future, but I received the reviewers commen...

Chemophobia from the most unlikely of all places - a grant reviewer. Has anyone ever seen this before? http://bit.ly/IcmSAL #chemophobia
— John Spevacek · Fri, Apr 06 2012 08:08:30

Saturday's twitter dialogue:

Chemphobia - from a grant reviewer? (via @jkemsley) http://bit.ly/Ik3DYN
— biochem belle · Sat, Apr 07 2012 05:18:34

What the hell? RT @biochembelle: Chemphobia - from a grant reviewer? (via @jkemsley) http://bit.ly/Ik3DYN
— Mags Lum · Sat, Apr 07 2012 05:20:56

@biochembelle It's equivalent to saying Alcohols are very sensitive and very toxic. It's not all the same.
— Mags Lum · Sat, Apr 07 2012 05:22:51

@ScientistMags Yeah, it's pretty ridiculous. It's the sort of comment one expects from the 'chem free' fanatics, not so much a scientist...
— biochem belle · Sat, Apr 07 2012 05:24:32

@biochembelle Maybe it's time to have a look at the qualifications and experience of reviewers.
— Mags Lum · Sat, Apr 07 2012 05:25:19

@ScientistMags Of course, it's not clear from post how comment affected score. My guess-not much, sort of thing addressed in JIT.
— biochem belle · Sat, Apr 07 2012 05:29:50

@biochembelle One would hope otherwise something is very wrong.
— Mags Lum · Sat, Apr 07 2012 05:30:45

@ScientistMags @biochembelle @jkemsley I don't know that this is chemophobia. I think it is a veiled attempt to say they haven't addressed
— ScienceGeist · Sat, Apr 07 2012 05:32:38

@ScientistMags @biochembelle @jkemsley how it will be used. or a backhanded way of saying that the reviewer doesn't think the researcher
— ScienceGeist · Sat, Apr 07 2012 05:33:12

@ScientistMags @biochembelle @jkemsley can handle it. some reviewers are REALLY picky and will look for ANYTHING WHATSOEVER
— ScienceGeist · Sat, Apr 07 2012 05:33:44

@sciencegeist @ScientistMags @jkemsley Agreed-some reviewers are super picky. Perhaps reviewer felt it was legit concern that should...
— biochem belle · Sat, Apr 07 2012 05:37:42

@sciencegeist @ScientistMags @jkemsley be addressed post-review if funded. Doubt it's type of comment that would alone sink a grant.
— biochem belle · Sat, Apr 07 2012 05:38:56

What's the most dangerous chemical you've handled?

Jyllian Kemsley — Wed, 14 Mar 2012 01:56:38 GMT

Chemists weigh in

Storified by Jyllian Kemsley · Tue, Mar 13 2012 18:56:38

The Periodic Table of Videos asked that question of faculty and staff at the University of Nottingham, and made a video of their responses:

Most Dangerous Chemical - Viewer Questions · periodicvideos

Inspired, I put that question out to the audience of C&EN and The Safety Zone blog:

What is the most dangerous chemical you’ve handled? | The Safety Zone

Courtesy of the Periodic Table of Videos, faculty and staff at the University of Nottingham discuss the most dangerous chemicals they’ve ...

The Journal of Chemical Health & Safety pointed out that "dangerous" can mean many things:

@jkemsley Dangerous how? Toxicity, flammability, reactive? Dangerous because of the amount? Very broad question...
— JCHAS · Tue, Mar 13 2012 10:32:15

Accordingly, some people responded with explosives:

lead azide, TATP & HMTD RT @cenblogs What is the most dangerous chemical you’ve handled? http://bit.ly/wzgylZ
— Radium Yttrium · Tue, Mar 13 2012 04:24:19

TATP is triacetone triperoxide and HMTD is hexamethylene triperoxide diamine. Lead azide, TATP, and HMTD are in a category of explosives that are generally sensitive to impact, friction, or heat. TATP was one of the explosives used in the failed "shoe bomb" plot in 2001.

Liquid oxygen condensed in a trap on a vacuum line can react violently with any organic matter also caught in the trap, something that usually happens unintentionally:

@jkemsley @cenblogs Oooh ... forgot the one time I came back to lab one morning to find a trap that had a little liquid oxygen in it.
— ScienceGeist · Tue, Mar 13 2012 08:13:35

@sciencegeist That doesn't really count as 'working with it' does it?!
— Stuart Cantrill · Tue, Mar 13 2012 08:14:21

@stuartcantrill um ... no. doesn't make it any less dangerous or "touchy" especially when you are unprepared to see it.
— ScienceGeist · Tue, Mar 13 2012 08:30:47

@sciencegeist I have vague memory of discovering glass all over lab + decimated vac line one morning as undergrad, best guess was liq O2
— Jyllian Kemsley · Tue, Mar 13 2012 14:21:11

On the toxic side, hydrogen fluoride/hydrofluoric acid got the most votes:

@cenmag HF is the only thing I've ever used where I felt like I needed someone at the ready with a safety precaution (calcium gluconate)
— ScienceGeist · Tue, Mar 13 2012 05:26:40

Hydrofluoric acid! RT @cenblogs: What is the most dangerous chemical you’ve handled? http://bit.ly/wzgylZ
— Jacquelyn Gill · Tue, Mar 13 2012 13:11:28

+1 RT @JacquelynGill: Hydrofluoric acid! RT @cenblogs: What is the most dangerous chemical you’ve handled? http://bit.ly/wzgylZ
— Kevin Anchukaitis · Tue, Mar 13 2012 13:12:43

Anhydrous HF +F2 gas , you? @cenblogs: What is the most dangerous chemical you’ve handled? http://bit.ly/wzgylZ”
— Sylvia McLain · Tue, Mar 13 2012 13:12:09

@girlinterruptin @cenblogs ohh same here! And we both survived :)
— Dr Jess · Tue, Mar 13 2012 13:13:47